Virtual Ninbot Building

I added a red sofa now inside.

Here is a picture with the red sofa

There's no direct stream like with Radio, if you could display flash apps in there it might be possible.

I went looking for OSGRID and downloaded but got dos windows up and not much more, maybe I got the wrong thing or hit the wrong site.
Was all a bit too much the site I went on, can't remember the link now but for the average person they'd probably give up if they hit the site I did.

I'll try that link see if I do any better this time. :)

EDIT:
Yeah that link wasn't what google thru up for me before, this is a nice and simple site for people to use.

I also wanna point out to people they need the hippo viewer, unless they want to run a server and have a place in the world.

EDIT 2:

Gave it a go, it all went badly wrong, I fly, not far then it wanted to start a stream so I did then I lagged, then was walking through a mountain.
Anyway I changed to another connection cos kids might have been on other, connected and was good, didn't fly but music was playing and had a chat with a few.

Some graphics is lower than SL but others are better but overall its pretty good and can only get better.

So is there anyway to make NINJAM LAND where Ninjamers and Ninbot can live?
and some guy was saying it takes about 200kbps per user so 5 people need 1mbit upload, that's a lot for most home users.
But the world is starting to see more 100mbit connections now so maybe someone has the bandwidth to share. :)

For Video Feed I'll be doing an offline Video mix for our Cosmic Drifters Cover which could maybe be streamed form somewhere that works for OSGrid or played in there and I'll make it nice and long so its not too loopy.

Were probably do some Closed Sessions in the near future or if not u can use the Stream from the NINJAM TV which I'd mix on the fly locally.
Else Some levels can be very bad and kill the music instantly, if loud and it sounds in place it don't matter but when its not in place and too loud it just screws it up, and with viewers that's not good.

I've done a few in the spur of the moment little gigs in SL now and got good feedback, Shadow is very competent with his setup now. I struggle more atm with 1 pc doing all but I'll sort that soon, throw a machine based on a good dfi or asus mobo to handle video. I'm able to mix live cams into a VJ Mix, I've setup me other Midi Hud so I can setup another little midi keys to control the VJ Mix but that will take some setting up, day or 2 setting up all the stuff midi will control in there.

For me any gig is open to others if they are setup right.

To Tom, is it possible for you to change topic and even pw settings through ya ninbot?
Mainly topic though so when a Session goes active on NINBOT.com it changes topic in the server to Live Robotics Session or whatever the session on is.
When I got it on NINJAM TV and I announce what people are listening to I will follow it by somit like a ninbot.com punt.
But in the Future I'll say somit like "In Association with NINBOT.com, the Place where Music is Born."

EDIT:

Been listening to last night's event and its recordings are killed by guitars too loud.
Last night I mixed it local to the TV so when people got too loud or played random s*** I lowered or almost muted them out then brought them back in again when they were playing in the same progression and key again.
But unfortunately because I chanced some settings with out disconnecting from the TV Server I lost the whole thing but 10 mins right at the start.

When I get the other machine built this won't be such a problem and I will use another connection just for video and audio streaming.
Also then if there is a server I can stream video too which others pull from and not from here then I could maybe push a 2nd stream for OSGrid.

But if ya have somewhere we can do some practice gigs in there then arrange some times for the weekend gmt'ish time. :)

Hi Andy, Hi everyone ,

thanks for checking all this out.

OSGrid is basically the same as second life but everything is free.
A nice person generously gave me free land for the Ninbot building.

If you may already have the Second Life viewer then you can just use that.

1.) Just register a nickname at Os grid and then login

2.) create a desktop shortcut to your Second LIfe viewer but right-click and change the target to the following:

..\SecondLife.exe --channel "Second Life Release" -loginuri http://osgrid.org:8002 -loginpage http://osgrid.org/loginscreen.php -helperuri http://osgrid.org/

2A.) Or you could also just download and use the Hippo viewer. It should already auto-populate these fields for you - just login

Locate the Ninbot Building on Map Search - the Region is called " base - bab "

Adding Ninjam TV Cam -

I would need some viable link to a video stream that will play in Quicktime player. If it can play in that, then it should work.

I dont know which cam site you all use but maybe something like -

Justin.tv -

rtmp://XX.XX.XX.xx:XXXX/live_user_ninjam

LiveStream -

rtmp://xx.xx.xx.xx/mogulus/Ninjam/[identifier?]

or maybe -

rtmp://fme.mogulus.com/mogulus/[channel_name_here]/username=[your_username]/password=[your_password]/isAutoLive=[true|false]

In this case- I might need to know the password for the account.

To conclude -

if you can get the cam stream to play in QUicktime player then it should work. -

I would just need some kind of - rtmp:// or rtsp:// link.

Alternatively, if you have already any archived video that will play in Quicktime, I could just use that for now.
Ideally something encoded in Quicktime as .mov file.

Hosting Ninjam/Ninbot Land -

To host something like a Ninjam Land region - maybe for exp: where Ninjam/Ninbot users could each have their own virtual Homes where they could have things like archives of their jams and personal stuff as they do on ninjamers.ning.com

this would require a few options:

Many people on Osgrid host their own region using Opensim on their own home server if they have enough bandwidth.

So Unless we could find someone who could setup Opensim and host it for us.

Maybe somebody could offer us an entire region for free, but I would doubt it. SOmebody probably would give us a free parcel of land though - as I was given for this Ninbot Building.

But if not - then what you would probably need is -

1.) A dedicated Server - this typically is expensive

2.) A VPS - virtual private server - this can be as low as $15US a month.

Some Osgrid users even offer VPS hosting with Opensim already preconfigured ready to go.

One inexpensive example - is Sim On Demand -

Sim On Demand
More Info

This is a temporary Opensim pre-configured server which one could use to host a Ninjam Land only when needed ( maybe for concert events etc.) It works on a Pay only for what you use and probably works out very inexpensively.

Heres One idea -

Maybe we could setup some kind Paypal type account on ninjamers.ning.com to finance Sim On Demand for - Os Grid Ninbot/Ninjam Land group concert events- (there seems to be alot of people registered on ninjamers already)

We could promote events and even use a tip jar both in world on Osgrid Ninjam Land during the event
and also on ninjamers.ning website. Sim On Demand probably would be an inexpensive solution for just temporary group events. Pay only for what you use.

rtmp://fme.mogulus.com/mogulus/ninjam

Is the Link, I can't give ya my password but if u setup to livestream and give me ya user name u used then I'll add ya to the Team in NINJAM TV Studio and this should be enough to get video from it.

It's worth a try and would make things a whole lot easy.

Once I got ya on ya would use a link like:

rtmp://fme.mogulus.com/mogulus/ninjam/username=youruser/password=yourpw

Once I set ya up in the team in NINJAM TV it will be a valid channel for ya to login to with ya own user and pw.

Hey Mutant-

Sounds cool. Is there any way to have a webpage
show up inside the building?

One of the things we really needed when
doing second life shows was more ways to communicate
between the ninjam server and the club.

For quicktime streams thats really great
mogulus can hook up to SL. Maybe we can
send the list of players or something
as a camera source to mogulus somehow,

Hi Tom, Hi Andy

Tom -

There surely would be probably more than few ways to have the ninbot page in the building.

Second life now allows Display Web Page on a prim as a media source.
However this may not work in Opnsim.

Also, scripting could accomplish it, however again , similarly I beleive that not all Linden script commands will run perfectly on OpenSim.

I should mention that the person whose region the building has been built on currently does now allow scripts on this region. But he does allow it on some of his other newer regions, so I could possibly move it to one that allows it, no problems.

Ideally it would be cool to somehow display the list of people jamming like the way the ninbot site does. Also to possibly even display the google map like ninbot does. I have seen Google Map displayed in Second LIfe and I also know they have some type of map scripting commands already built in to display the Second Life Grid
just like Google Maps.

Again all of these could be possibly implemented through some scripting, however this reaches beyond my already limited Second Life skills. Therefore If someone more knowledgable could maybe help me, this would be great.

I could also even use some Second Life musical type objects to create a stage perhaps ( amps, guitars, lights, drums etc )

Andy -

I have registered an account now with those Livestream people.
Here is a Link

My user account page name is mutant.
I dont actually have a camera though and in fact am quite horribly mutated to look at in real life, but I would like to somehow see if I can add the Ninjam TV cam to the little building.

Ok , so anyone let me know if you are interested, or stop by the building and visit.

Hiya m8, I added mutant and it added user Zouhayer, that you m8?

Just wanna make sure I added the right one.

If it is give it a go, see if ya can pull the stream. will be great if ya can.
If not I'll look into it a bit cos the procaster can pull a stream of NINJAM TV so it must be doable.

Hi Andy -

I'm sorry, I think I gave you the wrong info.

My page is /mutant but my user name is "mutantcam".
I don't know who "Zouhayer" is, but maybe he plays the bass :)

:D I best remove him then before we get some wierdo strang guy on the TV. I probably added a pimp with out knowing it. :)
k I'll add that user name, the mutant is a channel so its probs added someone with user name mutant.

Ok I added it, try again m8, if I see a naked man with big bling then I know I added wrong one again. :)

Andy -

I logged into my livestream account now and I do see NinjamTV listed. So I guess let me know the next time you have the cam running and I will try to see if I can grab some URL to use.

Maybe I can also add some sheep or other virtual barnyard type animals to have in the 3d building as well, should Zouhayer now demand them.
I know that kind of thing is popular in Second Life :)

Ok thanks, so let me know some time.

Yeah Sheep are popular, but can be dangerous for Welsh people.

Also if you are able to pull the NINJAM TV it should send the TV stream whether cam is on or not.

If it works it opens a massive window of opportunity over SL and if you work it out it would be worth keeping stoomp on the details which will help OSGrid grow.
It would allow people to host a show in OSGrid and the ease of setup and routing them into OSGrid then would be very easy, along with studio tools it could be extremely powerful and professional.

I'm not sure if the rtmp: link will work but I think it could be possible to find the correct link to pull the stream, if not there would be other ways to pull the stream into OSGrid which would also allow ease of setup for any performer.
This would also help NINJAM TV grow to show more live shows that could be viewed in OSGrid and Online via Web.

So give it a try on pulling the NINJAM TV stream, if it don't work let me know and I'll try find the source of the stream. The source wouldn't contain ad's so it's not something they would want to allow access freely to anyone.

EDIT:

Ok I found the source links, not sure how fixes they are, but for live there more fixed then for the Automated Programs on NINJAM TV, they change regular.

As for the Live, when a cams on it throws up a dif set of sources and one of these may work in OSGrid.
I used a lil flash player embed to test but it didn't play but the stream doesn't seem to be encrypted.

Have I got you on Messenger Mutant? I can give info and we can test some link live sometime.
If you get it setup somewhere to pull a rtmp stream then I can give ya 2 links, if they don't work it possibly wouldn't be achievable that way.
But maybe another way using rtmp if not the other way then it could be achieved for sure yet another way. :)

Andy -

I dont have a messenger program but will get one if you want.
You could also just send me PM here or on Ninjamers site.

I have been lookin at a bunch of possible solutions but no luck.

Livestream combines all jammers cams into one stream.
This is exactly how we want it to appear.
Rather than just one persons camera.

I checked out the livestream studio - but cannot see any clues as to offerring any rtsp:// or rtmp:// URL that will play in Quicktime player.

I will look into a solution more. Also -If you or anyone want to try to help, just install Quicktime player. If you can get anything to work , let me know.

Some other programs to look into additionally are:

Veodia

VLC Player & Streaming server This can do rtsp:// streaming

Wowza Streaming Server
this also can do rtsp:// streaming

All offer free versions of their applications.

Also -
Dreamhost Webhosting - they offer Quicktime Streaming using the open source - Darwin Media Quicktime STreaming Server - prices start at just $5.95 a month US.

one last idea :

Maybe using some type of free online video file storage such as :
blip.tv
youtube
Google Video

We could somehow show special archived video/audio of past Ninbot Group jams. The same way NINJAMTV plays random archived clips when not broadcasting live.

Blip.tv , and google video both allow for .mp4 direct links to be created to videos

and even Youtube Mp4 can also even be used to convert & render a temporary .mp4 video

All we would need is a video encoded in .mp4

This solution wouldnt be a live video cam but it still would be kind of cool.

AT least the audio stream works from Ninbot already for live audio anyways, hopefully I can figure out how to get the camera stream or videos working now.

Ok thanks Andy for your interest and if you have any info or help let me know. ALso if any other Ninbot users have any help please let me know.

Thanks everyone.

I'll PM ya the links but there more live links, would expire when live stream stops then become new when it starts again.

One of them might stream it.

Also I brought the stuff for a 2nd machine to handle just Video and Cams so my current machine can just handle the audio side of things.
Will have it built in a few days hopefully.

I've got a sim in Secondlife, i'd be happy enough to host a building on it free of charge if you guys are interested.

I'm a developer by trade, my job is pretty much making stuff in SL for corporations so I'm pretty good at building and texturing; I can build a pretty kickass building to be host to ninjam in SL if you'd like

Hit me up inworld, SL name Neil Robinson.

Best,

Neil.

Hi Neil -

Thanks much for your interest and very generous offer.

I checked out your region AbPrefabs and the buildings were awesome.

Certainly there are more people in SL than OSgrid, which is better generally. But I have come to really like Osgrid alot because it is open and growing.

With all that being said however, it would be a great thing still to have something along the lines of your generous offer of one of your builds hosted on your region.

The issue at hand though is how we can get ninbot players cams to stream simultaneously into either OSgrid or SL. The audio streams already work fine.

I myself now may have found a workaround solution to this webcams issue.

Of course if we had someone running a Quicktime server or even a Darwin server this could probably be quite easily accomplished, but typically these things cost money. I dont have either or any of this and doubt realistically someone would offer this to everyone here as a charitable community service. I also doubt enough here would
be willing to donate any money for it. But I always could be wrong.
If you saw the building I made on Osgrid, clearly I am a novice builder and also pretty much of a newb to just about everything.

Maybe I or someone else here can look you up to chat more in SL or even on OSgrid or just here at these forums. Then we could see what maybe we could get going in all this stuff for the benefit of everybody.

Thanks again

Hiya,

Neil there was a place before called subclub, not sure if it still exists in another place on the net but would be cool to have a Ninjamers Home in SL.
We have another site http://ninjamers.ning.com as well and what would be cool is a place called Ninjamers.
Reason being for this name is it represents all ninjamers so could hold events from ninjamers, ninbot, ninjamons, vlb and other NINJAM Groups.
Else it becomes a tug of war over whom think they own it and who does own it and so on.

Our site is called Ninjamers but its more about the different groups of ideas and groups of people on there.

If you do make a place called Ninjamers then its worth making a page for it on here and http://ninjamers.ning.com and we can let all know they can arrange events there. There are a lot of SL'fers on here and there and some do shows already so have the fan bases, so this will help get it regular visitors.
But which ever group do a event or gig in there they can supply you with a banner and maybe you could even make a few themes for the building to suite genres, e.g. Clubby, Acoustic, Rock, Ambient etc type musics. Then if someone has a rock group and want to do a gig they just let ya know, give ya a banner and u set the theme a few days before with an ad in there somewhere of the event to let regulars know its comming up.
You should set conditions to what YOU see fit as it's your place and we get to used it for free from your kind generosity. This would be best or groups using it most start to try control it because they lead themselves to believe its theirs.

If you lack time to commit as much as you would like, maybe you could make mutant an admin of some sorts, he'd be pretty good, his got a tough skin.

But not to take away from OSGrid, maybe if you have time spare you could help Mutant with the project over there or lend him and ear when he needs it for some help.

Also one last thing, have you thought of a good alias for club owner? Like Big Daddy or Big N or The Boss. :)

Andy - can you PM me here or on Ninjamers with your email. I think I may have found a workaround solution to the whole Webcam conundrum.

BTW - A good alias for a club owner should be Zouhayer.

Hey guys!

Unfortunatley i'm too busy to actually run the thing, but I can happily donate a big ol' chunk of land and create a building for it to live on, and yeah I'm happy enough to make someone an admin / estate manager so as they can run the thing.

Getting a sim seemed like a great idea, I was going to sell houses and stuff just for fun and as a way to be creative when the corporate projects weren't keeping me busy - hasn't really worked out because i've had a packed work-schedule all year so I've just stuck a few houses down and given the land to friends of mine to have their own shops or whatever on. I like having the potential to do something, so I'm not planning to get rid of the sim, but seeing as I'm paying for something i'm not using, it might as well benifit a community I think is cool!

Ping me inworld, Neil Robinson - I'm on all the time :) (as in now, too.)

Best,

Neil

K Neil, sometime tomoz I'll add ya on there, I'm AndyMc Mcsomit or another. :)

I'm building furniture at the mo in RL and I have no idea what I'm actually doing, just making an idea in my head and building it. So far I've predicted most faults before I done them but its taking all my time and brain power to produce something. :)

So all day tomoz I'll be making doors for a sideboard, sounds easy but I get fatigued and start making stupid mistakes so I have to get in the zone cos there's no undo button. :)

But when I have a lunch break I'll try add ya then.

Here is a simple way I found to potentially have Ninjam/Ninbot users Live streaming Webcams displayed in either Osgrid or Second Life simultaneously.

Using the program VH Multi Cam as a broadcast source streaming through Wirecast as Quicktime.

In the pictures below you can see a test I did featuring four randomly found live webcams all streaming in Windows Media mms://

All you do is simply add each URL into VH Multi Cam and specify the application as the video source in Wirecast.

Perhaps someone else here with enough bandwidth and a fast enough computer or even a server, could relay some webcams into Second Life or OSgrid for special multimedia virtual concerts using this method.

Picture 1
Picture 2

I also now added 2 video screens already in the Osgrid Ninbot building.

Here is Dr. Funkenstein from the live music video channel stream.

Free Your Mind

and your Av will Follow.

So the multi cam studio could pic up Windows media encoder, which can be easy to get people setup on.
If you look online for any of the ustream's, stickams, justin's and others that might pull into sl or osg then we can always stream to one of them, that way the server part is taken care of.

I did see on SL site one time about ustream had been pulled into sl.

ustream's, stickams, justin's - all interface with flash in streaming. nothing I have found with any of these sites points to a Quicktime rtsp:// stream .sdp type URL needed to simply paste into the parcel media to play as video in either SL or OSgrid. So thats why I found this workaround solution. That basically someone could re-stream webcams using Multi cam if they have enough bandwidth and CPU power. the participants would just send said re-streamer person their link directly.

multi cam studio can probably pick up most kind of streams generally from WIndows mms:// to perhaps Tcp/Ip type webcam streams like http://xxx.xxx.xx.xx:7070 that type of deal. Maybe also you could send your stream from FME to it, idunno.
I only tried it testing with mms:// Windows Streams because they seemed more readily found. Windows media encoder is of course free BTW.

The only thing you could probably do with SL /Osgrid and ustream's, stickams, justin's etc.
would maybe be something like to stream OUT of SL/Osgrid onto Mogulus etc.
where each Ninjamer logged into SL or Osgrid client with avatar and used a screen capture to stream their POV on a virtual stage. That would be cool. but its the opposite of what we were trying to do.

But you want to try that -

use VH Capture -

it allows you to specify which program to capture from.
So the user could just leave the SL or Hippo client window opened or minimized while their avatar sits onstage on a poseball animated looping playing, each stream would be from the different avatars POV sent to mogulus etc.

Then they could simultaneously have Reaper open as primary window for the music stuff. Im not sure how you guys send the audio to mogulus though. But its already on the ninbot server so np there.

Lastly, I guess if somebody with enough Bandwidth and CPU wants to install the open source >Darwin Quicktime Server on Win XP. You just also need to install Perl. You could probably use Multi cam again and everything would stream out as Quicktime , ready to be sent into SL or Osgrid.

Happy to try streaming from ninbot
but we are on Linux which makes this even harder.
Btw arent mms: streams multicast? (ie less downstream bandwidth)

Tom, thanks much certainly for everything here with Ninbot. I know I really have fun.

But realistically I gather there probably isn't much interest among the registered folks here for Ninbot/Ninjam Live Video/Audio SL/Osgrid type events. Other than maybe just me, Andy, you and or the few else here who might occasionally get into it. Neil's offer really is super though, as he is a Pro builder etc.

So I sincerely wouldn't want to burden you with having to setup some video server kinda thing now in addition to maintaining the Ninbot site.

But please - if anybody wants to just visit the Ninbot building in Osgrid- hopefully it should remain online for some time to come. Maybe we can do more with it as a group here or even with Neils SL region to.

Streaming video in SL via Quicktime - doesn't seem that accessible to everyone, as most probably don't have a server or much else to do it sufficiently.

However in my search for info-
I understand that a upcoming SL client
will support HTTP textures - maybe this could open up the possibilities for people to input video streams via more typical webcam streaming formats.

Lastly, I did however find one new possible way to stream Mogulus/Justin tv "player.flv?channel=Ninjam" kind of video maybe-

Realxtend now has Http refresh properties for textures. As well as also accepting flash .swf and Vnc desktop capture for sources as parcel media in Opensim.
heres a link
where someone is referencing a simple youtube embed on a webpage.
These new features with flash might be able to somehow work with the Mogulus/Justin tv type stuff, as those sites probably are similar to youtube.

I understand the guy who created Ninjam also worked on Nullsoft video. Its to bad they couldn't have incorporated even something like that it. I believe I have seen other online music apps that have some video built right into it.

ok. later all.

I got the other machine built to handle video stuff, on my bandwidth I really need a hardware encoder to get the best quality so I might look into it.
On FME to get best quality on my bandwidth causes stutter, just cos it can't encode enough quick enough at the quality.

I'll have a look about see if there is something better for realtime encoding or look see if there is a optimized vp codec.